Holding on to the board... Or not!

[tomthetreeman]

I’ve been surfing for a bit over a year, and progressing well for a 48 year old guy with shoulder injuries lol... Started on a 9’ longboard and 8’ foamie, stepped all the way down to a 6’ Sweet potato and some other smallish boards. I’m currently digging a 7’ Ukulele Mini cruiser (Chris Ruddy shape), which seems to be a good ‘short’ board for me right now.

When the surf gets over about shoulder height at the steeper breaks that I surf, I just can’t duck dive either of these boards deep enough to escape the wrath of the wave. Sometimes when I hold on to the board, I get seriously pummeled and tossed back inside. There are times when I simply find it safer to me and others to just ditch the board and dive down (the flying projectile of the board limited by the leash being slightly safer than the uncontrolled chaos of me going with it). The size and power of the waves I’m talking about is too much for turtle rolling fwiw.

Do I just need to improve my skills? What do the more experienced surfers with bigger boards do? I’m always busy staying alive at these moments, so I haven’t really seen how everyone’s getting out back when it gets big & nasty. I know where the rips typically are, but they are of little help on these days. Thanks for any advice/criticism in advance!

Tom

[BoMan]

I ride a 9 foot longboard at a beach break and don't go out when it's bigger than 5 feet so keeping that in mind...


Look for channels, holes and breaks in the sandbar where you surf. These low spots can be used to find a line outside. This is more obvious at low tide when the bottom contours come into view.

Keep looking for those rips.

Time your paddle out between sets. After riding a wave I will sometimes sea anchor my board and let a few foam walls wash by. I face the shore, then slide back bringing the nose up.

Get in shape to paddle FAST. When there's a break take full advantage to get outside. I swim freestyle sprints in the pool at a local JC. One of the teachers was nice enough to write surf workouts for me and they kick my butt!

[jaffa1949]

Amen to what Bo says, knowledge, the fitness to use it. Throw your board is a dreadful last resort, can you really guarantee the Kleist will hold and your loose board won't hit someone. Turtle and Eskimo should be strong enough to do the holding been pushed back heap left sets of grip prints in the foam.

If I can't get out. It is not my surf! Huey has spoken!

[Oldie]

I heard the name"Chicken Dive" for this and have a deep scar on my head from an idiot doing it without any need in pretty calm conditions (overtaking me me in 3ft surf while I was heading for the shoulder, then crossing my path and throwing everything away when the wave looked a bit steep). It stranded me for four days of my vacation. So please never consciously do this.

[tomthetreeman]

I’ve certainly never consciously done it with anyone near me or visibly inside of my position. I do my best to duck dive or get through the wave, there have just been times where I knew I was gonna get killed, so I did it. I’m not proud of it, just wondering what you guys do or if you can relate your experience. I’ve had people needlessly do it around me, and that definitely sucks! I’m glad I don’t have any scars.

Tom

[waikikikichan]

1) How are you “Holding on” to your board when turtleing ? What technique are you using to keep forward momentum?

2) How did you get out with the 8’0 and 9’0 in similar conditions?

3) How are the other mid-length surfers making it out ?

[tomthetreeman]

I typically don’t turtle roll with these smaller boards, I do my best to duck dive. With the larger boards, I would grab the rails and roll over, sometimes letting the wave pass between me and the board, sometimes pulling it in close. I readily admit that I don’t know if I’m doing it right or wrong, but it has worked in medium sized surf when the wave interval was tight or my timing was poor. In addition, to answer #2 further, there have been times where I didn’t get out, and times when I ditched the board before I knew it was a bad thing (I haven’t had a surf buddy or mentor, so I’ve learned a lot by trial & error). Now that I know better I’ve only done it a handful of times since.

I’m not sure how the other mid length surfers are getting out. These conditions/situations have been few and far between, but as stated in my post, when I’ve been overwhelmed, I’m typically not paying attention to the other surfers. Also, at the steeper breaks, sometimes there aren’t any longboards out when it’s big, presumably because it’s too difficult. When they are out there on bigger days, they definitely cut their rides short! The guys that do get out are probably more experienced and better paddlers than me.

Tom

[oldmansurfer]

Partly there is some responsibility for the surfer on the inside to get out of the way of the surfer on the outside. Even if a surfer tries to hold onto their board there is no guarantee that will happen and what if they were trying to catch the wave? so if someone is out side of you it's your job to get out of their way. If they paddle past you or whatever same story. I am pretty sure lots of beginners can't hold their boards and regardless of what they do it's going to be coming back to you if you are inside off them. So yeah it's not good to ditch the board with people nearby but people nearby shouldn't be inside of you also. I say this though never having surfed heavily crowded breaks and there is always room where I surf to stay out of the way of all the other surfers. However if I feel a need to ditch my board I also dive and go the end of my leash so the board isn't a projectile and this also pulls the tail under and allows the wave to roll over it without catching it too much. I am lucky there is usually no one around so I can ditch my board if I want to but still I rarely ditch it (as in not even once this year so far) and I can't do a proper duck dive with my board and I probably go out in more hazardous conditions than most of you. I do a half duck dive called a duck dip here on this forum. You need more practice going under waves but more than that learning when and where to go under waves and how to avoid getting pounded (wave reading).

[Tudeo]

Good question and great responses, everything I wanted to say is already said..

Just kidding.

I can add that it can get hectic out there, especially for the intermediate surfers who are looking for bigger waves but sometimes don't jet got the skills to stay out of trouble like getting caught inside.

It's a good habit to try and hold on to ur board, not only for the safety of others but because you never know if your leash will hold. Where I surf can be scary to lose the safety of the board.

Have you seen The Art Of Longboarding from Wingnut? He talks about this and shows how he tries to hold on to his board in tricky conditions by pushing the rail op front in his stomach. Sometime that works, but in the end there's only so much you can do, you're up against bigger forces than yours.

[Big H]

I surf crowded areas....I never, ever ditch my board, will rather get thrown and tumbled with it than kook out and hurt someone.

[dtc]

2 tips

- when you turtle roll, the key is to get the nose underwater. So long as the nose is below all the white wash, you are usually fine. Grab nearish the nose (a foot or 18 inches - depends on the board) and sink down)

- seems kooky but... wax the rails (and even the bottom) of the board where you are going to grip it when turtling

I guess improving grip strength might also be a tip? Just do lots of pull ups

[Lebowski]

I typically don’t turtle roll with these smaller boards, I do my best to duck dive. With the larger boards, I would grab the rails and roll over, sometimes letting the wave pass between me and the board, sometimes pulling it in close.

Tom

Shoulder high waves shouldn't present any problem on any craft really, unless they're relentless and very powerful, pitching waves (unlikely given your 1 year of experience).

If you can't duck dive deep enough, turtle rolls are very effective even with a longboard. Don't let the wave pass between you and the board. If you do that, it will get ripped hard out of your hands. You need to paddle towards the wave to give yourself some forward momentum, then grab the board (approx under your shoulders) and roll under. Let your body hang down, don't try and stay parallel to the board. Pull the nose of the board down into the water a little whilst simulaneously thrusting it forward through the wave. It sounds like a lot to think about but this should all be done in one quick, fluid motion.

When you're done, get back on the board quickly and keep paddling.

[tomthetreeman]

Thanks for all the replies, guys. The beach break where I’ve had it handed to me can definitely be treacherous at shoulder high... And right down the street is a point break that you need a longboard to catch, even at shoulder to head high, it’s so mellow. The interval at the beach break is usually short, so it’s often a difficult paddle out, even when it’s not huge.

The advice on turtle rolling is awesome, thanks! I think that’s the missing part of my technique (Although I’m just barely getting proficient at duck diving... Working on it still!)

I’ll watch the Art of Longboarding again - It’s been a while!

Thanks again fellas!

Tom

[BoMan]

if I feel a need to ditch my board I also dive and go the end of my leash so the board isn't a projectile and this also pulls the tail under and allows the wave to roll over it without catching it too much.

Great advice. I never thought to do that.

I do a half duck dive called a duck dip here on this forum. You need more practice going under waves but more than that learning when and where to go under waves and how to avoid getting pounded (wave reading).

I'm still working on this. BIG waves push me off the board because I can't get my log deep enough. I'd like to learn more about "when and where you go under the waves."

[oldmansurfer]

To duck dip I do almost a handstand shoving the nose of my board under water not even trying to get the rest of it to go under because it won't go then I kind of dive down under the wave as well but it hits my rear end and the back half of the board which is sticking out of the water this however is a good thing because it pushes it down completing the duck dip and I pull up on the nose and come up still on the board and ready to paddle like heck before the next wave. Where and when has to do with reading the waves and knowing you don't want to be where it is breaking so be outside of the break or well inside of the breaking wave so you can go under it or time it between the swells to get from inside to outside. So when and where is about reading the waves and timing.

[tomthetreeman]

Here it is today at about shoulder-head high. I wish I had time today, but I was only able to see it from the surf cam... This is a typical 4-6 foot day at Narragansett. As you can see, the interval doesn’t allow much time between waves! For whatever reason, it seems like it’s usually like this when it gets big. Relentless!

[oldmansurfer]

To get out usually the shortest route out is the best. This means the shortest route to outside of the surf and not to where you want to surf. The goal is to spend as little time as possible going through the breaking waves. It looks to me like somewhere on the left is that spot however it also depends on currents.

[RinkyDink]

Here it is today at about shoulder-head high. I wish I had time today, but I was only able to see it from the surf cam... This is a typical 4-6 foot day at Narragansett. As you can see, the interval doesn’t allow much time between waves! For whatever reason, it seems like it’s usually like this when it gets big. Relentless!

I lost a long post to this thread so I'm just going to throw out a couple of tips this time around:

-- On a 4 to 6 foot day like the one in your picture, there should be a decent rip current to help you on the paddles to the outside. I'd scout the rips when I got there and find the closest one to the peak I wanted to surf. Use the rips like a conveyor belt to the outside.

-- Start forming an idea of the strength of the waves you surf. I know I can't turtle roll, duck dive, or punch through a head high plus wave when its lip impacts a foot away from the nose of my board. How close can I get to the impact line of the lip and still successfully complete a turtle roll, duck dive, whatever? I have to come up with an answer to this question every time I surf somewhere. In other words, find out what your limits are. I already know when I'm paddling toward a wave if I should slow down and let the wave break first and expend its energy or whether I can sprint over it. Of course, you're going to screw up your estimations so you need to plan for that as well. I don't see the point of sprint paddling for the outside, using all your energy to get outside, and then making it 10 inches away from where a double overhead wave's lip is coming down. That's a futile waste of energy for me so I control my paddle-outs with respect to the wave in front of me, to the number of waves in the set, and other factors that will influence whether I stop padding for the outiside (wait for a lull), start sprinting for the outside, or something else. Anyway, good luck.

[Tudeo]

a 48 year old guy with shoulder injuries

You better be careful with that shoulder injury, holding on when turtle. When a wave gets a hold on the board there can be a lot of stress on the shoulders, it depends on the injury how it deals with the angle of impact.

[tomthetreeman]

You better be careful with that shoulder injury, holding on when turtle. When a wave gets a hold on the board there can be a lot of stress on the shoulders, it depends on the injury how it deals with the angle of impact.

Roger that. Believe it or not, one of the worst things other than paddling, is when I surf without a leash on small days. Don’t worry, I only do it for practice and when it is not crowded. Sometimes if the wave starts to close out I need to step off the board and grab it from the side, which can give a pretty good yank on the shoulder joint.

Tom